1.4 WY
NOTES OF MEETING WITH RESEARCM DIRECTORS
Lausanne Switzerland, 16/17 November 1983
Present: Or H Gaish Philip Morris
Or M Bourlas Pnilip Morris
Dr R R Boxall uall3hers
Mr U C Owen Imperial
Dr R W J Williams Rot ri,-.4 n s
Mr H 5 Grice TAC
Or L C F Blackman 13AT
Th e ne et i img wa s pro bat) I y t h e most ef f e ct i v e yet - w! t h n o
s i S n of i nt e r -c om pa my wr anS I i ng a nd a c I e a r- de s i re t o c o I I a too r a t e
where the subject -.,#as non-comifter-cial
Smokin2 and Copin,:!
AL
nr Williams reported tnat Professor Warhurton of Reiiing
University is pursuinc, his belief that peopPle smoke for very
many reasons other than to obtain nicotine.
Mr Owen said that when Professor FrogC;att visited 1-:)erial a
few wa?ks ago he also reco:;niSee that there were oenefits of
snaking which. while perhaps associated with nicotine were not
related to addiction or naoit, formation.
The 3-eneral feelin; was tmat either the Incustry. or inaivinual
companies. s@kcult seek recoqnised researchers in tht Ut, volo
woule ne willin;/),een te work in the :eneral area o'
11 nd copir;. Since no names were forth-car-1-i--, LCFI@ ?-entioned
the work of Professor Ivor Mills at Ca-inri-j3e University on
compulsive and excessive eating,/non-eatin;, snokino gne drinkin;'.
.41 tnOL@h it was oelievec- ttiat the stu.lies could no-. ze of .7.ircc@L
value to the tcoacco industry, it coull ')e of help to nave
clear evidence that 'exessive' use of totacco was not associated
with addiCtioll but with a particular -IsYchological function.
As such, all cunpanies expressed interest in seein:; the
protocol of Professor Hills' proposed )ro-ratime possibly
with a view to TAC formally consicerin-, inviting Professor miils
to talk to the Research Conmittee about possible sponsorship.
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Alternative to the UK Tar Reduction Programme
The background to the discussion was the recent TAC note TE 1808
that outlined the companies' various attitudes an the question
of the 13 mg limit for 1987.
As previously intimated to the ISC, we saw no scientific
argument that Was relevant to the proposed target. On the
other hand, Mr Owen said that at the recent meeting Froggatt
had made it clear that he personally believed the tar reduction
programme was running out of steam and that the ISC 4 repo.rt
should focus on the scientific aspects of smoke quality - a
term which should include both particulate and vapour phase
noxi a .
The conclusion of the discussion was that as an industry we
are now running the risk,.
(a) that by failing to co-operate with the Government
in agreeing a target under the new Voluntary
Agreement and
(b) by, in effect, rejecting the proposal of the ISC
that we should jointly consider the questions of
tar quality and other noxia
we shall find ourselves out on a limb with no sympathy or
support from either the DHSS or the ISC. Indeed, the ISC's
own credibility with the Government could be severely weakened
to tne point that there could be overwhelming pressure (with
the St imul ous of the New Scientist etc) to abandon research
discussions in favour of legislation against the indsutry.
Mr Owen intimated in fact that Froggatt is appeared to be
depressed by the results of the is to date - and by the
entrenched negative attitudes of some of Its scientific
members (Ross and Holland?). He seemed anxious for his term
of office to tome to an end (1985).
It was concluded that this group of company scientists should
invite Professor Froggatt and one or two of his scientific
advisors to meet with us to discuss the difficulties that we
believe exist in pursuing an experimental approach to tar
quality and other noxi a . The invitation should be sent well
before the next TAC/IS meeting scheduled for 1Z January 1984
though a meeting before then was unlikely to prove possible.
At such a meeting, neither the TAC or individual companies
would commit themselves to setting up and funding new lines
of research. We must, however, be open In the discussion and
not reject the ISC points out of hand.
A suggestion from Or Boxal I that an ad hoc sub-committee of <=
company statisticians should prepare an argument against the 13 %10
mg target was rej*cted. CX:)
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-3 -
TAC Review of Research Activities
I was prepared for criticism from the other companies about
the eleventh hour intervention by SAT lawyers on many aspects
of the galley proof of the publication. My explanation about
the extreme sensitivity of many of the issues, and of the
vital need to be safe rather than sorry, was fully accepted.
The early conclusion that the best procedure would be to
cancel the Review altogether was replaced by a proposal that
the BAT modifications should be accepted for the body of the
document - and that in the section dealing with the results of
grantees research the present statement prepared by the
grantees should be replaced by much shorter statements of
results prepared by TAC and agreed by the grantees. This
proposal will be put to company lawyers by Mr Grice via the
Research Committee.
L C F BLACKMAN
28 November 1983
CC Mr R J Pritchard
Mr W J Dickson
Dr R E Thornton
Miss A Johnson
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